The Whet Palette Productions: Miami Food Blog & Podcast
I’m a Cuban-American writer and podcaster who’s been telling Spanglish food, life, and travel stories since 2013.
What started as a passion project has become a trusted, recognizable brand in South Florida’s culinary scene. By keeping it authentic and always showing up with curiosity (and probably a wine or cafecito on hand), I’ve built real relationships with chefs, restaurateurs, and a dedicated following of fellow flavor-hunters.
My coverage ranges from white-tablecloth fine dining to the no- frills neighborhood spots. I was raised on pan con mantequilla, but my appetite spans the globe.
Beyond the plate, I bring a background in interior design and dance, giving me a flair for aesthetics, rhythm, and storytelling that resonates with our vibrant audience. Think of me as your go-to guide for all things delicious, beautiful, and culture-soaked.
Listen in as I tap into a hyperlocal community that’s vibrant, loyal, and always ready for the next bite (or adventure). Just don’t ask me to choose between a Michelin tasting menu and medianoche. I’ll take both, thanks.
Brenda
The Whet Palette Productions: Miami Food Blog & Podcast
S5 E78 The Making of Palma: Chef Juan Camilo Liscano’s Unscripted Journey
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What happens when a chef who spent much of his life moving finally decides to come home and build something of his own?
Chef Juan Camilo Liscano joins The Whet Palette Podcast to trace the path that led to Palma, his intimate restaurant in Miami’s Little Havana. Born in Miami, Liscano’s culinary perspective was shaped by family, travel, and formative kitchens across Los Angeles, Mexico City, New York, Miami, London, and Paris.
We discuss the chefs and restaurants that changed how he thinks about ingredients, the lessons he carried home, the unexpected turn his career took during the pandemic, and what it required to create Palma from the ground up.
Listeners will also learn about Palma’s design, the meaning behind its name, the evolution of its frequently changing menu, the one dish that (thankfully) refuses to leave, and how MICHELIN entered the story far sooner than expected.
Palma: https://www.eatpalma.com/
The Whet Palette: https://thewhetpalette.com/
Subscribe for more candid conversations with the chefs and hospitality leaders shaping Miami and the wider culinary world.
Grab a glass of wine. Sit back. Listen in.
From my "palette" to yours.
Cheers!
Brenda
I absolutely do it because I love it. Yeah. And I was going to claim about it. Welcome to a new episode of the Wet Palad Podcast. I am your host, Brenda Poprikin. Today's episode is special. Miami-born Colombian roots. We're walking through this chef's journey. Kitchen by kitchen, city by city, to understand how discipline, restraint, and identity come together on one counter in Little Havana. Welcome, Chef Juan Camilo Liscano.
SPEAKER_00Hi. Thanks for having me.
SPEAKER_01Is it consider Little Havana, right? That little area?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, so it's kind of like on the interesting. Right when you cross that 7th Avenue Bridge and it turns into 8th Avenue, you're entering Little Havana.
SPEAKER_02Okay.
SPEAKER_00But I think growing up, and I think for a lot of like Miamians, that area is considered like uh maybe riverside or something like that.
SPEAKER_01Like just I feel like unincorporated date, like it's just Miami. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Like it's just part of Miami that is extremely close to like downtown and and and Brickle and Well and the ball the ball stadium now. Yeah. Yeah, where it's you could walk there, I think, in less than 10 minutes.
SPEAKER_01Probably. I was just there last week and d that entire area is kind of blowing up.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Yeah, now it is. Yeah, now there's there's I think uh I just noticed for the first time Miguel was telling me that Bagatel like opened on our side of the river. Yeah. Uh not too far away. I think they're using the lot like in the corner of the restaurant, because I'm always seeing like Bentleys and G-Wagons, and I'm like, I don't know which one of these like restaurants is using it, but now it makes sense.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, but you have Sea Spice and you have all these like what I call tiki tiki places.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Um and then you have Garcias.
SPEAKER_01And then you have Garcia's, yeah, but that's been there for ages. Okay, let's take it back to the beginning because we'll we're gonna get to all this Palma Scoop later. Um, you were born and raised in Miami?
SPEAKER_00I was born in Miami.
SPEAKER_01And raised everywhere.
SPEAKER_00And I moved a lot growing up. My my dad always said the term an airline brat, because I I think a lot of the children of people that work in airlines, they tend to move around a bit, especially um during your lives. It's like every two years, I think two to three years, we'd we'd move somewhere new. Sometimes, you know, we're uh in LA for just like nine months, you know, just barely there for the school year.
SPEAKER_01Right.
SPEAKER_00And then we moved again. So it was always uh moving around.
SPEAKER_01And then you you mentioned that you ended up in Broward.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Yeah, so we we did quite a bit of moving around. I think after being uh in the Midwest, you know, in a very, very cold place. I think both of my my parents, you know, they they split and then uh they both decided like let's go back to South Florida. And uh we ended up in Weston. Uh started what was it like uh I think I started in eighth grade at um Falcon, I don't know, I don't remember, Falcon Cove, I think.
SPEAKER_01I don't know. I went to school in Miami. Yeah I only now live in Brown, but uh I am Miami raised.
SPEAKER_00But uh did your middle school and then stayed there throughout high school and uh graduated and immediately moved to Los Angeles.
SPEAKER_01But that's so that was at least a good stretch for me. Yeah, that was our longest. Four years are important, those middle middle school to high school.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, those like four years, that was the longest we ever lived anywhere in my entire life, aside from me being an infant.
SPEAKER_01Right. Were you relieved? You're like, okay, finally.
SPEAKER_00No, not really, because you know, when you're young and and uh you you make friends and you have a best friend, and then you like pick up your life and you move it, you know, so you get used to living this way, and and uh I think I was always expecting like next, are we gonna go somewhere else? Yeah, and I I kept doing that like throughout my career because it was it was normal for me. I was like, okay, right, like where to next.
SPEAKER_01Okay, but you can't leave Miami.
SPEAKER_00No, I I I love it here. There's a reason I came back and I'm staying there. This is the longest I've ever lived anywhere in my entire life.
unknownOkay.
SPEAKER_01Good. Okay, so and both of your parents um Colombian?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, from Cali.
SPEAKER_01De Cali, both.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Okay. Do you how how is that did that influence on your relationship with food in any way? Um you know, I do you have anything that you go back to from growing up Colombian household in a Colombian household?
SPEAKER_00So my mom cooks like very well, and my dad does too. Um, but my mom's uh my grandmother, her family moved to Colombia from Palestine. So I grew up with a lot of like Middle Eastern like kind of dishes, like like I was just at Mandolin yesterday, and he was doing these like Persian cauliflower fritters. I was like, this is literally the thing my mom used to make me. It was one of my favorite things to snack on. It's like a green onion batter. It's not really supposed to be crispy, it's more like doughy. You just dip like uh boiled cauliflower into it and fry it, and it's super delicious. Um, so I grew up with a lot of that. Um she went uh to university in uh Mexico in Puebla. So I grew up with a lot of like Mexican food as well, and uh it was always tasty, like it was always enjoyment, it was always a little bit of like comfort and a lot of flavor. Um so yeah, I think naturally coming from a Latino family, like food is important.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, say that again. At what point did cooking shift from something around you to something you wanted to pursue professionally?
SPEAKER_00Um so I always uh I always enjoyed cooking from like a young age, like a teenager. Uh my mom worked, she's a full-time social worker. Um so it was me and my little brother that'd be around. So naturally there'd be like heat this up, boil this pasta, you know, put it together. No, not like that either.
SPEAKER_01Okay, that's that's what I was doing when I was coming home.
SPEAKER_00Uh you know, thankfully, uh, you know, most of the time my my mom somehow would find the time to like leave us things in the fridge, you know, but it would always be like reheat it the right way. Or sometimes we would want a pasta and just like open a can of tomatoes and fry some garlic and chili, and you dump the tomatoes in and you figured this is pretty easy, you know, I can do this. Um so that was always fun for me, like from an early age. And uh I immediately kind of my dad got an opportunity to move to Los Angeles, and I thought, you know, I didn't take high school so seriously, so I didn't do any like serious college applications, I didn't have like a vision or like a path, you know, uh for school. So I thought, you know what, let me go with him. Um he'll let me stay with him and I can start school at uh community college and take it from there and see if what comes up. Um and I was just miserable. Like, could it be more miserable? Um going to school every day, being forced to take classes on things that I just were not even relevant to my interests. Um and my dad's like, you enjoy cooking at home like so much. Like, why don't you just try to get a job in that? So Craigslist.
SPEAKER_01Do something.
SPEAKER_00Everything.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00I am not joking. I think I sent like over a hundred and twenty applications with a letter, like just no experience. I'll do anything. And I got a job making uh frying french fries in a burger joint. Okay, like in uh Sepulveda, like this weird area just outside of the airport, just outside of LAX. And uh I did that for a few months. I was like, this is kind of fun.
SPEAKER_01I try to go find something like um I was gonna say, do you still like french fries or do you like have resentment over?
SPEAKER_00No, I had french I had french fries last night. Um but I kind of thought, okay, let me see what else I can find, like in this uh in this industry. And um at the time my mother was like going through uh operation, so I came back here to kind of be with her while she kind of recovered. And um at that time the chef Alex Chang was doing the food at the Vagabond in uh Miamo. And with Alvaro? With Alvaro, literally just talked to Alvaro this week. Yeah, I I when I met Alvaro at at the restaurant, he came by and I was like, you know, you're like we're talking about it, it's like you're part of like my beginning, you know? Interesting. Um and did that until like unfortunately the the project closed, and I thought, you know what, my mom's better now. I'd like to go back to LA and like kind of like see what else is there. I was uh uh I was 19, I think, and my first day in a kitchen was New Year's Eve night at the Vagabond. And I was just like hooked. I was like, let's go. Um so I I'm gonna go.
SPEAKER_01What were you doing in the kitchen at Vagabond at midnight?
SPEAKER_00I New Year's Eve. Oh my god, on New Year's Eve, I was I was making probably this like ceviche with like yuzu and like puffed grains. Uh I remember that. Like I remember this really good tomato salad with like a black sesame vinaigrette. Uh I remember this beef tartare that was dressed like lab and uh you put in like big nasturtium leaves. Um I remember I remember some things from uh from that restaurant. The food was really good. Um so I went back to LA. I asked Alex to kind of like set me up with a job at Animal, which is where he was at before he left. So I went there, joined the team. I think every time I started a new job, I was like in over my head. Like a little bit, I was like a little bit green to I think be at every place, but um you were faking it until you made it. Yeah, I know it worked out. Um and uh I did that for about a year. We got James Speard Award that year at Animal. That was a huge deal. We did so many incredible like chef dinners after. I think uh doing one with St. John uh from London with Fergus uh Henderson. I think seeing that like started to like pique my interest a little bit about like Europe. Um and then from there I he was going to be the chef for the freehand like hotel that opened in downtown.
SPEAKER_01Miami's 27? No.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, so they they uh they s I believe, you know, don't quote me on this, but I think they sold the brand to uh Siddell Group.
SPEAKER_01No.
SPEAKER_00And then no, this was years ago. When it first started, okay. Yeah. Uh and then they started opening like Freehand Chicago, Freehand New York, Freehand LA. Um, so the one in LA, beautiful restaurant. LA, okay. Uh went to go help out with that, and and then I had started um working with incredible. I think one of the first chefs that like kind of changed my uh my the way I think about ingredients and like where things come from and like how to move with it as it changes uh very quickly and abruptly sometimes. Because you never know when a farmer's gonna get like a frost or something and it might kill an entire crop of something that you're depending on for the week.
SPEAKER_01In LA?
SPEAKER_00In LA. Um most of the farms are like north, like Northern California or like Central California. Like not a lot of them are actually in Southern California. It's a little bit too dry, and the and the wind is so strong, especially in the summer. They call it like the Santa Ana winds. I was just gonna say that, but I was like, it just feels like a you take a hairdryer and you put it up to your body sometimes. And um, but we would take wheelbarrels. Uh this was when he was a chef at Michael's in Santa Monica, which is very close to the Santa Monica farmers market, which I'm sure you've heard of. It's like arguably the best farmer's market in the entire country.
SPEAKER_01I was just gonna ask about California seasonality, so I'm like, you're gonna right into it.
SPEAKER_00A little segue.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Um and we would take these wheelbarrels and uh, you know, little like carts, and this is a big restaurant, you know.
SPEAKER_01We would you say which chef it was?
SPEAKER_00Miles Thompson.
SPEAKER_01Okay.
SPEAKER_00He has now uh Baby Bistro in Los Angeles. They've been getting so much great like write-ups and publicity. Um incredible chef, really kind person too, like truly one of the kindest people I ever worked for, would give you the shirt off his back. Um helped me a lot, both personally and in the kitchen. And we would go like early in the morning, go talk to the farmers. Sometimes we'd like sit down and eat like a tamal with them or something and bring them coffee and uh just see what was good, and sometimes we just like change something, like on a whimp on the menu for that week, and we bring it to back to the restaurant, and that was always that was like where the work started. It's like okay, now we gotta process the produce like stacked to the ceiling. And we're such a such a tight team. Like it was maybe six of us in the kitchen cooking for like 200 people a night and making like you know, it's not like we're just tossing pasta and butter, and like you can pour it into a plate very easily. It's like we're making like plated food in the zone. Yeah, completely. And the kitchen was huge. It was set up, you know, the line was set up to have like 10, maybe 15 people working it. So you were like running back and forth. Um, but it was a wonderful, like wonderful time.
SPEAKER_01Do you think there's anything in your cooking now that like it's like a nod to that time?
SPEAKER_00You know, every once in a while I'll make something and and uh like I have mentioned like Miles, like in the post, I think maybe twice, where I've made something. It's like this is so him. Or like I'll make something like uh he always liked using like Japanese ingredients, but like kind of in a more like Italian way sometimes. And uh you know, like he might put like Yuzu Kosho on like a salsa verde or something. Um and it was really, really tasty. Like he just made like such flavorful food. Like you can never say anything that he made is like bland. Um, and I think that's something that I always kind of like keep in the back of my mind, and having a bit of agility to like change the menu like when we need to, or just you know, change it every month.
SPEAKER_01I know. The numbered things.
SPEAKER_00I love that one. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01I have a collection going on. Okay, so then LA.
SPEAKER_00Uh so then LA long that was that was almost four years. That was like three and a half maybe a little bit more than six months, like somewhere between three and a half and four years. I was there from uh yeah, pretty much like 19 still through like 22. And uh it was a wonderful time. Like I I think it was a great place for me to go and kind of come into my young adulthood. Um there's anyone and everyone from everywhere around the world in LA. You get to learn so much about different cultures. There's a little everything, you know, by that I mean like there's I think three different little Tokyos. There's little Armenia, there's little uh there's Thai Town, you know, in Hollywood, there's Koreatown, which is the largest population of Korean people, like outside of Korea, so like the Korean restaurants and supermarkets and everything, like it's super strong and uh and like authentic, and and getting to almost feel like you could travel as like a young cook to different countries when you go to these different neighborhoods is super, super I think it's beautiful.
SPEAKER_01Not enough Cubans though.
SPEAKER_00I you know, there was one uh one of the most famous bakeries I feel bad Portos is in uh in LA and it's a Cuban bakery. Okay, yeah, you should I will be happy about that. You should check it out.
SPEAKER_01Once I check it out, yeah.
SPEAKER_00Um man, I'm blanking. There's one Cuban restaurant. There's one Cuban restaurant, and I used to go every once in a while for some vaca frita when I was like thinking about home.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I mean to be honest, that's not what I'm going to LA for.
SPEAKER_00No.
SPEAKER_01Or my Cubans, but you know, they're there.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, there's not a lot of Colombians either.
SPEAKER_01I I that it that would be, yeah.
SPEAKER_00I met like one Colombian four years in LA.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, they're probably like from Medellin, like somewhere else.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it was it was it was hard to find that food too. Um, but everything else was amazing.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, it's teasing.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. And then and then uh I went to go do a stage at uh Quintanil for a summer.
SPEAKER_01Okay, and that happened how?
SPEAKER_00That was uh that was actually Alex again. Okay, yeah, I reached out to him and I was like, hey, I'm kind of you know, I'd like to go see something else. Something else. I'd never really seen like fine dining like that yet, and I was very interested. I'd always had like um like Mexico like in the back of my mind too for my mom. Um so I wanted to go there and uh I hit him up. I was like, hey, do you know anyone? Like I know you'd done like a stalge there in the past, and he was like, Yeah, uh this guy, me uh Miguel or uh Cholo as he would call him. And uh put me in touch, and two weeks later I was like, Here I am, bye. Here I am. I moved out. I you know so used to moving at that point that I was like I could put all my things in one suitcase and good. Um and I went there and I got this was when Airbnbs were starting very cheap and starting, and I got a little like studio above uh Mescaleria in um Condesa for like I think 18 bucks a night or something, and it was like perfect. I stayed there, I'd go there, I'd be there from like seven in the morning to like one in the morning, and just trying to soak up as much as I could uh from uh from all the talent that was there.
SPEAKER_01You speak Spanish, right?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah. Um and it was fantastic. I worked so much, um but I learned so much too. And they they make things from such a deep understanding, I think, of uh like Mexican cooking and cuisine. Like sometimes like we would take recipes that are like super, super, super old and you know, and and we would go look at okay, like how can we kind of rework this like in a modern way but still being true to like the spirit of like what this is supposed to be. Um it was really uh it was a really nice time. And I I I realized that I really enjoyed um all the kind of intense I could put behind uh some fine dining restaurants. Like I think Key Tanyal does. And uh after that summer was over, I came back to Miami. I slept for like a week, and then I was like, I gotta work. And I think uh at that time was when Dragor Sunda just opened and I was I saw, I was like, oh great, they're serving like my favorite things, it's like Parker House rolls with honey, like honey butter, and like country ham.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00And I'm like, oysters. I was like, let me go see like what's going on with this.
SPEAKER_01They're calling my name.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, and I and I went there and it was like you walk in and it's like an apartment building, you know, kind of hard to find, and and I sit down and it's like, wow, this is like super well priced. The cocktails were like fantastic, and uh it just felt very like like honest, you know, like there's no bullshit there, you know, like it was you're getting what you think you're getting, and then some, you know. Um and I really enjoyed that. Like I and I think it shows a lot of like who Will and Carrie are the things that they make. Like I think it still feels like it's it's very honest. Like you never feel like you're getting cheated or slighted in any way. Uh so Jaguar's son, uh, pretty new. I asked him for a job like right there, right after I finished snacking, and he said, Yeah, come in.
SPEAKER_01Do you finish sleeping?
SPEAKER_00Sorry. I slept for the week and then I was like, let me venture out and find a job. Yeah, it was almost like a like a cartoon.
SPEAKER_01I mean, Jaguar took took Miami by storm. Like it was like, oh, we were all obsessed.
SPEAKER_00You were still obsessed, but yeah, yeah, of course. I mean, how could you not be? It's um tell me where you could have a pasta for less than $20. Um especially one that's made there.
SPEAKER_01A good one.
SPEAKER_00I was gonna say a good one. Yeah. Um, so I I I did that for like nine months. And I I always told I from the beginning, like I told Carrie, and I was like, look, I just want to be like up front with you. I'm not gonna be here like long term. I'm trying to figure out like where and what I want to go do in my career like next. Uh like whether or not that makes you want to hire me less now or whatever, but I just want to have like a clear conscience and tell you that now before we go into it. And he was he was good with it, and um it was really really important, I think, to like see that and see it kind of start building.
SPEAKER_01Um plus Miami's momentum at that point was chugging along.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah, I think at that time was uh a lot of the people that you see very like established today were starting around that time or had just started within those like few years, I think. Um and you know, like look at us now. Like I think it's a beautiful like food city that is growing. Um and then you know talking with Kerry and getting spending without him. You know, he was uh with uh Pascal Barbeau and uh Le Astrants uh in Paris, and it was like one of my favorite cookbooks at the time. Um and uh he was also sous-chef like at Co. in New York. And I was like, man, I always wanted to like go work for Sean Gray. Like he's such a like there are like chefs' chefs, you know, like there are chefs that like other chefs really look up to and and try to like um maybe like capture a little bit of like what they do. Um and I think from that point forward I always try to go work for those people. Uh so I asked Carrie, I was like, can you set me up? At least set me up with like a stash, you know, in New York. I was like, I really want to go work at Co. Uh I had never had any experience in any sort of like one, two-star kitchen, anything like that. I was this was meanwhile, all this is happening within like me being uh getting to the end of like 22, right? So I finished my time at Jag. It's the early summer. Carrie goes, okay. He says, just get there first. Yeah, so I'm like, you want me to like just go drop everything and just go on like a maybe? And he's like, Yeah, he just says get there first. And I was like, I'm here. Alright, fuck it. I call a friend, I was like, I need to come stay on your couch for 10 days, like I think most people do when they move to New York. Yeah. And um I go do that, I do the stage, uh, it works out perfect. I think they had like five cooks leaving at the time, and they're about to go on summer break. So I staged two days, got the job. Uh thankfully, one of my friend's roommates was moving out that summer because he had uh he was moving in with his girlfriend. So I went into his room, had a place to live, everything was easy, and uh I just had to wait out the summer break. And then uh and then I started. And then the real work started. I was the youngest person working in that restaurant, you know, two Michelin star restaurant in New York City. Never lived.
SPEAKER_01Two starred of all the two, like the least um not least, like the most different one. So all the other twos are they have a pattern, they have a thing that they're all very similar. And then you have co.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it was very it's not like it was very contrarian.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Like it was even some of the comic, like I remember that.
SPEAKER_01The wild card of all the twos.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, like I always remember this um Changray dish. It was like poached celery and like uni. And I was like, how did how did you think of that? But like in my head, I'm like, I can see it, and I can see how that tastes really good because like celery kind of has this like ionine oceanic flavor. Have you ever had um like Percibe's? Like it almost tastes a little bit like that, like that sense of like oceanic flavor, and like uni has that too, with like a touch of sweetness, but like the small lobe uni.
SPEAKER_01I'm gonna go look at my picture to see if I ever had that.
SPEAKER_00Um but yeah, just like having the confidence and like the idea and like the follow-through to like push through with like dishes like that uh at that level in New York City, nonetheless, where there is the constant, I think, underlying tone of like being competitive with other restaurants around you because you're literally pulling for diners. Um it was really, really cool to see. And uh of course, like I wanted to go learn how to make changres like Pithavier's. Uh I always saw like all of their proteins were like perfectly cooked. That was another thing that I went. I was like, I want to go learn this. Uh talk about the duck. Oh, duck? Which duck?
SPEAKER_01Hmm. One of my not in PBTA form.
SPEAKER_00No.
SPEAKER_01No.
SPEAKER_00So we did that.
SPEAKER_01Literally just a beautiful duck on my plate.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And that's part of what I was talking about where it's very different. It wasn't like plated pretty and nothing was like it was just the most perfect duck.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, but that's it.
SPEAKER_01Like here's your plate with a duck.
SPEAKER_00That's uh that's like true luxury though, you know?
SPEAKER_01It's like to have a try it, doesn't matter.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it's like to have like a really nice product prepared perfectly. It's like that's real luxury. And one of my favorite like duck cooking techniques that we did was like we would kind of crispy skin. Yeah, so we did a malto stip like like pecking duck. Right. But we would put red wine in the malto stip um instead of water. Um, and then it would dry as well after the malto stip, and then we would kind of uh temper it in a smoker, so then it would get some like smoke flavor on it, and then we would hang it from a hook. Do you remember what year it was?
SPEAKER_01Probably mmm 18.
SPEAKER_0018. I started there the next year. It was there, it was like just breaking a year, and then um the pandemic hit.
SPEAKER_01Right. No, it was definitely before that.
SPEAKER_00He was always famous like for those like duck dishes.
SPEAKER_01Like that was that was I mean I'm still talking about it and it was 17.
SPEAKER_00Like uh we would also like kind of take the duck like um on the ground and uh on the crown still and uh put it in a pan like ripping hot and just kind of like rub it and a few times and and then go in the fridge like quickly to chill and uh and do that like over and over and over until it was like perfectly cooked. Um it was a really great way to see like how every single little step like kind of builds up to being able to serve something so like minimal. Um like I think a lot about like Japanese cooking in this way too. It's like it's such a minimal cuisine that you really see it where like skill and like preparation and like ingredient becomes like the most important thing to get to the end.
SPEAKER_01You were saying earlier about the egg.
SPEAKER_00Uh yeah we're talking off camera. The egg. The egg it's so funny because it's like so simple. It's uh Okinawa like potato, like sweet potato vinegar. It's very like tart vinegar, usually used um I think for like sushi rice. Subise, you know, nothing crazy, just onions that were cut like this, and this thickness. Very classic butter, but we use the cave-aged butter, which is another reason why the subice tasted so damn good, because it was aged butter. Um the perfect egg that sits in the smoked water like for 24 hours. Um testing you, chervil, chives, but the shervil has to be like you know, alive, obviously, in chive batons. You only cut with the skinnier chives, not any of the like thicker chives, and uh of course like caviar and the little fingerling potato chips. And like that was it. And it went with the the butter, the aged butter and uh sourdough bread that we made every single day, and it was a great way to eat bread in a meal, and it was in the middle of your meal, it was not in the beginning.
SPEAKER_01That I don't remember.
SPEAKER_00Um it's uh it provides like a more like intentional way to like enjoy a bread course, especially when someone's making bread there every day for their guests. That was uh that was a good dish, but I cut so many. Oh my god, like when you are boiling eggs, sometimes uh you don't know how thick the white is because sometimes the yolk is a little bit more suspended and sometimes it sits a little bit more in the base. You know, you're just hoping that it sits a little bit more in the base because you kind of have to cut the egg towards the thin part on the top of the egg, like the if it's a cone. I guess if this is the egg and this is a more rounded bottom and the tops here, you're cutting it here, right? Which is where the whites are thinner. So it's even harder to just cut the white, but you're keeping the yolk whole. You don't want to break it because you need the guest to have that moment of like breaking it, and you know, the egg yolk goes everywhere. So you cut it with a bird's beak knife, and then you gently with the tip of the knife, like split it open, and then you make the little canal of caviar, and then you gotta place it like right there in that little bit of egg white that you split open and do that 24 times.
SPEAKER_01Right.
SPEAKER_00Straight. Um that wow moment, and it was like it's such a simple dish, but like that little like preparation like made it a little bit more like difficult. And it's great. It's like something that I'm sure you crave. I crave it sometimes.
SPEAKER_01Like it's uh even the chips, you kind of can do you have more back there. Can you bring some more of those chips? I like that.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it's uh that was a great dish. Now that you can get it at Sunny's.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I was thinking about that.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Um I made so many of those. But yeah, co was uh it tastes different though.
SPEAKER_01It doesn't taste the same. I mean it's still good.
SPEAKER_00I think it's because the butter? Maybe the butter. Um I mean it's still solid, but but I also don't know, I don't know, they could be getting like cabbage butter too, but the caged butter was expensive, you know, and it was made there in New York as well. Um it was like a a dairy creamery would age it for us, and sometimes it would it's just like so good. You open the pack and it just almost smells like cheese. It uh has this like grassiness to it. It's hard to beat. It's like good butter is hard to beat, you know?
SPEAKER_01Yeah. I have a friend who smuggles in French butter in our luggage.
SPEAKER_00I I would too. You know, it's not the first time I've talked about smuggling butter from France this week, actually. Uh one of my I'm like, how do you keep it on?
SPEAKER_01Like, that's a long flight. She's like, I do it.
SPEAKER_00Luckily, well, you know, if you're if you pack it in the center of enough clothes, if you're there in the summertime or something, the process, the only thing you gotta worry about is the bag getting from your hotel to the plane. But once it's a big thing. It's a bad stare inside. But the cabin, you know, where the bag sits, it's air conditioned. Yeah. So from there you're good. We're good. You're coasting.
unknownOkay.
SPEAKER_01101, you heard it here first.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Olive oil, butter, enduya, sorrisata, all that stuff that you're worried might melt.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Just make sure you insulate it with your cold clothing.
SPEAKER_01Okay.
SPEAKER_00But make sure it's packed well.
SPEAKER_01Of course. We don't do any of that at all.
SPEAKER_00Um, so I was I was like, Co. And then the the pandemic hit.
SPEAKER_01But let's go back to Ko for a second. What was Chang's role at that point when when you were there? Sarnus. I was saying Chang's role.
SPEAKER_00He was barely he wasn't there. I I think that Ko was widely known all over the restaurant group as something that operated on its own. Like it was to be untouched. That was Sean Gray's and Sue Wong's operation.
SPEAKER_01I always felt like that concept would work really great in Miami. The co-concept.
SPEAKER_00Uh like having the cobar in front and the tasty menu.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, but just every like the food, because it wasn't as um it was fine-dining, but it wasn't really fine. Like it wasn't the service part of it was not as very on purpose.
SPEAKER_00It was I mean, Sue's a legend, I think, in the hospitality industry um around the world, and also in New York for for that specifically, like this kind of more relaxed human touch to like hospitality that's like you're still hitting all the marks. Like the glass is never empty. The guest never feels like they have to like go find someone to get something that they need. It's invisible, right? Like invisible service. And uh she's super good at it. I learned so much because it's a it's an open kitchen. I never had to talk to customers until then.
SPEAKER_01And uh we were a party of six, so um Oh, you had it sat at one of the tables, so we had right, so we our experience was a little different because we had one of the tables.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah. Um so I had uh I learned a lot from her about how to manage kind of making sure that this customer feels personally like cared for. Like you're asking them about their day genuinely, you know, and you're trying to find something that you can relate to them with. Like not so many times you feel like someone is uh forcing, like being nice or something, or cordial attitude, and uh I think there's always something there if you try like enough to where you can connect with every single person on like a very human level to where they feel like seen and understood and cared for in a way that they appreciate. Some people appreciate not being spoken to so much, but they appreciate making sure that their plate is like perfectly placed in front of them, their utensils are perfectly aligned.
SPEAKER_01It's uh I live fixing utensils for for chefs and restaurants before I take a photo. Like, I'm why am I doing this for you? Like I'm about to take a photo and I'm like come on. I fix I replayed everything.
SPEAKER_00No, I I want to get I want to get like the little uh like get rests made for the utensils because with the quarks, like I have such a hard time sometimes getting it like perfect.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00And those uh I noticed the cork the other day. I don't remember.
SPEAKER_01I don't think I remember it before.
SPEAKER_00It wasn't there the last time.
SPEAKER_01Oh, okay.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it was something that we started, I was like, I don't want to like keep putting it on the table, you know, and I was like, we have all these corks, you know. It's like nowadays, like a lot of uh wine producers they put their kind of branding on it, and it's sometimes it's kind of cute, and it's also it's part of the restaurant. Like I want, you know, I I I think it's uh it's somewhere where people can also come and like enjoy a bottle of wine, and I want that to always kind of be in the subconscious, like wine to be attached to the restaurant as well, not just food and uh service. Um but back to like Sue's service at Co. is is is fantastic. It was the first time that I I had ever like thought about that experience. Um and it's something that I am always revisiting my memories of that and those lessons uh today because we we kind of uh we run a lot of the food to tables. Um it's a beautiful way for people to interact with everyone in the restaurant, and I think it also feels special for them. It's like who is going to talk to you about the plate in front of you better than the person that spent the last week slowly preparing things to make this. Um so that always stayed, and I think it's very important. Um important as well. It's like a nice thing to offer the guests.
SPEAKER_01The Quintonil experience, um their service was good, huh? No, yeah. I mean the service was great.
SPEAKER_00I mean, I I think the service almost anywhere you go in in Mexico City is gonna be great. Um that's another thing. I I love going there and revisiting because you just you feel so like cared for. Um and it's got a little bit of that extra like warmth from from from being in uh in a part of like Latin America. Um but yeah, it's beautiful. They're absolute like professionals.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_00Sure.
SPEAKER_01So then okay, so then co is co pandemic you were saying.
SPEAKER_00Co, pandemic, yay, pandemic, New York. God, New York was so weird in those early days. Like it was it was like
SPEAKER_01It's fine. They all came to Miami. When are you going away? Okay. Half kidding. They're still here.
SPEAKER_00They're still here double parking Sunset Harbor when I'm trying to get my croissant from true love.
SPEAKER_01Oh my gosh.
SPEAKER_00But hey, it's it's it's uh it's it's money that it's money that they're spending in the city. Miami has always been relying on on tourism and and people visiting us, and we we embrace it. It's just a part of ever since the city of Miami Beach decided we're gonna make these beaches nice, it grew tourism here by an insane amount, and it's like kind of solidified us as a destination. I go, you know, I went to Menorca a few years ago, and they're like, Where are you guys from? Like Miami. They're like, what are you doing here? You guys have the nice beaches, you know, and it's it's we're known everywhere for certain things. So like it's it's always going to be a place for transient people, and uh you know, we we deal with those problems as they come. Sometimes, you know, you get some bad people that come and visit the city and treat it like a playground. But yeah, I think uh I think just like embracing it and and taking it for what it is, because at the end of the day, the more people coming here spending money to dine, like at our restaurants, which like the amount of people doing like these independent projects, like Reco Beko, Shingo, My Place, um, you know, they're they're uh supporting the culture. Yeah, everyone else. I'm forgetting to mention a lot of people, but it helps grow the culture, like we need that money coming in.
SPEAKER_01Such a good core Miami group.
SPEAKER_00I think it's just gonna keep, we're all gonna keep like growing together. And uh, you know, Miguel on on uh Sunday was like, this is we're building community right now, and that's how I always have seen doing the collaborations. It's like not there to like make a ton of money, you know. It's like I wanted to do that menu for $85 per person because that's what we opened with. Like I wanted to do it to like revisit and like honor that and like kind of remember how we started and uh like where we've come and kind of get everyone together like in the same place and uh spend some time together because we're all open the same days, we're all open Wednesday through Saturday, you know, and and uh as much as we wish we could like go to each other's restaurants every week, we can.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Um so I think these like intentional collaborations are really important for like building and uh continuing to further like our own like interior like chef culture here. And it's uh it's been a lot of fun. And then uh back to the pandemic.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, COVID.
SPEAKER_00COVID, let's see. I was you know, we're in New York and we're kind of like thinking, like, what does it look like? I was about to sign a new lease.
SPEAKER_01It's very strict up there, up there.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I was about to move to uh to Green Point. I was kind of over like the fine dining thing. I was a little bit like burnt out for sure. Um so I was like, I'm gonna take it easy, you know, go work at this like French restaurant in Green Point, enjoy my time in New York, spend more time with my girlfriend, you know, and and uh just like live a little bit because my life was work. That's why I moved to New York was to work at Co. with Sean Gray and and and the team there and and uh pandemic hit. So we didn't feel right about signing a contract when I wasn't going to work every day, so I was like, I'm not gonna sign this lease. And then things they developed every day, especially in in New York. When it hit New York, it was like, alright, whatever this is is gonna continue to spread at a rapid rate if it's in New York City. Um and then we started realizing like, should we go back home? Because she was she's from here as well. And we're like, look, we don't know what's gonna happen here. It's a huge city, you never know how people are gonna act. It is um you're not so like in control of like the environment. Um so we decided to come back here until things were gonna like calm down, but like we never moved out of our apartments. Like we kept our apartments as is and with our things inside, and then as you know, like the whole world like turned upside down. And we realized like shit, we're not going back to New York. Like we're gonna stay here. Um so started thinking like uh what do I do? You know, like restaurants are closed, and it's not looking like they're gonna open anytime soon. I think I just came back and I it was supposed to be two weeks. It was yeah, it's supposed to be two weeks. I heard that so many times. It's just two weeks.
SPEAKER_01I mean, to be fair, Miami was back open within like two or three months. Yeah. Open-ish. You're like, yeah. What pandemic?
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Just wear a mask outside, we're good.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. And uh, you know, I I did that and I I was I was like pretty bumped out. I was like, fuck, my career was going so well. I had just like finished this like stretch at this incredible restaurant. I had so many like job offers, like just to go to Europe or like to go to like Asia, uh, you know, to like Singapore, like Tokyo to like go work, and I was excited, you know, it's like wow, like I'm I'm finally starting, I'm finally like getting to work, like in this uh upper echelon, so fine dining, I guess. Um and then everything stopped. And I was like, I always have and I still have this thing in my head where I'm like you need to make the best of your time, you need to make the best of your time, you need to keep like running. I don't want to end up like old and like regretting that I didn't do something or I didn't do this or I didn't squeeze the most juice out of this. Like I always have this like in my head, like I have to keep going, I have to keep going. Uh so it was really hard to stop. And um I tried doing like you know, like selling some like meals to like people like around my like my dad's like neighbors and stuff, like that kept me a little bit busy, but um, but it was tough. And then finally um Carrie started doing uh Sunny's in lot six. Uh outdoors, tables split apart. Miami, as you said, was open.
SPEAKER_01You were outside, yeah. You had enough different theme, it wasn't a steakhouse-ish yet.
SPEAKER_00No, it started with tacos, yeah. It started with tacos and picnic tables, tacos. It slowly moved its way, it's like naturally, because it's like, what can you do outside? You can grill, you know? And it's like there was no infrastructure.
SPEAKER_01It was literally a lot, yeah. A little shock outside.
SPEAKER_00Like no plumbing, no electrical, none of this. Like everything was slowly added bit by bit. Um, so I think that's how it naturally kind of like formed into being a steakhouse. Um it's like perfect time, perfect place, people from all over the country coming here because they could have some sense of like normalcy, you know. Um and we did that and it just exploded, you know, and and uh and it was it was cool and it was difficult. It was physically the most difficult job I ever had.
SPEAKER_01The summer's the rain, like all that. Yeah, the summer.
SPEAKER_00Imagine grilling in front of a thousand-degree grill outdoors, Miami summer, with a mask. It felt like you're waterboarding yourself.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00Like it was uh it was tough at the time. I was um I was cycling a lot, and I was like, man, Gator is not enough. But I had these like salt tablets that I would take when I were I would go on these long rides of like 50 to 70 miles, uh, even in the summer. And in the hardest points of the ride, I would take a salt tablet like every hour, and what it does is it allows your body to actually absorb the water you're putting into it. Um so I took those while I worked, and then I was good to go. I figured out like the recipe, but that's how much you know you would like sweat out there on the grill. And it was so busy, but it was it was fun, and we're all so happy to like be cooking, you know, like no one was still cooking anywhere. All my friends in New York, New York was sad, and now they're back and everything feels alive again, and it's so wonderful to see that. Um but we're just happy to be cooking, like outdoors, and it was uh it was it was fun. It was fun to get back to that and like um be doing something, and I did that for well, we ran Sunny's outdoor for like just over like two years, and I was with them, and and then we kind of like shut down lot six for a little bit because we were able to go back to Jaguar Sun and do the restaurant indoors, did that, and then we're like, fuck, everyone wants like Sunny's again, so they're like, we're gonna run it back again, and then went back to Sunny's, redid it, and then I was um kind of reaching like close to two years, like at that point, and I was already kind of you're like, who am I?
SPEAKER_01Getting antsy, you need to go travel somewhere.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah, no, I and I I told I I talked with Carrie, he's like, Look, I don't know what I'm gonna do, but like I know that I need to like go do something else. I was like, I'm thinking maybe of like moving back to New York and working for César. Like I was asking him and and uh like our mutual friend Chase, um who's uh uh Somalia there at the time. Like, you know, how's the how's it? Like, how's the environment? Like, what's this like? Uh and I'm like, oh man, like I don't know if I want to go get back into that, like in New York again.
SPEAKER_01Pretty intense, I'm sure.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. You know, it's three stars, you know, it's it doesn't, I don't think it has to be like that, but yeah, there's a certain intensity you need to like achieve, I think, anything, like at a high level. Like you need the you need people around you to like meet certain standards. Um I figured like maybe New York isn't the answer again. We went, we revisited, it still felt a little bit like I don't know, like uh like it wasn't the right move. We tried going back to LA, seeing like, oh, should we go back to LA? Um my girlfriend at the time, like um now my fiance, uh she never been to LA and I wanted to show her the city. But it was also like kind of in a weird place from COVID. Like I think it still is, um, from what I hear from friends, and you know, we kind of came back here like let's be here for a little bit more and then see like what's what and I figured let me go I saved all this money. I was like, let me go stage around in Europe and then see how I feel about this because her sister is in Stockholm. Um so the idea of living in Europe was not so crazy because she could have some family there.
SPEAKER_02Right.
SPEAKER_00And um everything's very close, you know. Even if we lived in Paris, it would be I think it's three hours or just under three hours to Stockholm. Like it's it's easy.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, or you could drive from here to Orlando, yeah.
SPEAKER_00Which is best. Um I'll take the Armagnac. Um so I I set up some stashes and and uh we went to London first. Um for two and a half months in the old space, not the new one in the strand. It was also when uh World's 50 Best was doing the ceremony there. So we were getting all these chefs from around the world coming into the restaurant, and it was it was so incredible. It's such a small kitchen, too. It's like barely any space, it's like not too dissimilar from like the size of what we had. Um and they're just like making this beautiful menu full of personality and flavor and uh just so unique and figuring out how to like work with the constraints of the space, you know. That's like uh we would have to get the meat delivery in for every day. Like the meat purveyor would age the meat to spec of what they wanted, and they would deliver like you know, half of a rib for the day because that's what we needed, and then the next day, the same thing, you know, another half of a rib. The idea of that is insane that he, you know, he he he got these people to like work with him in that way. Um and it was it was a wonderful, small, like young team, and uh it was so much fun, like it was just so much fun. Every single bit of time I had in Europe was so much fun, and it was reviving like a love for uh fine dining. And um I did that. I went to Lyle's for a few weeks. Um it was really interesting to see like this space that was like so small and like underequipped but still pushing so like far. And then to go to Lyle's and see like wow, they have this entire like cellar of like fermentations and hams and like charcuteries, you know, and and uh so organized the way that they had the team, like everyone worked a four-day week, like it was it was uh it was really cool to see as well. And they've they held the star for so many years, uh consistently. Um and then afterwards we kind of like had a little like mini vacation, and then um I saw that one of the restaurants I really wanted to go stage at was uh Maison by Sotatsumi, who was um he was a chef at Clown Bar before, and this was his first restaurant, but they closed very, very quickly after they opened because of the pandemic, and then they had to close again because of an issue with um like the HVAC system because they were next to an apartment building, so all the smoke from the HVAC was like blowing into the apartment, so they had to build a chimney along the side of this building, so exhaust above it. Right time, right place. You know, we were kind of chilling for the month of August because most countries are pretty much on vacation for August. And uh we get back and they sent me an email like yes, please come. And uh it almost felt like we were reopening the restaurant, and it was incredible. I after 10 days, I was like they called uh I called my girlfriend and say, I'm gonna stay here like until my visa's done. Like I need to see more, I need to like there's truth here, like there's meaning here. Um that's still open.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00It is. I have no idea how they don't have a star. I know it's a uh I know it's it's uh maybe a little bit more difficult in a city like Paris, but he is another, he's like uh I would put him and like Kobe Desmero, like in the same category of like chefs that other chefs really look up to. Uh incredibly creative, but like in a very um utilitarian way, you know. Um all the fish was coming in from Bass Country, like all the game birds were coming in from Burgundy, the produce from all over France and sometimes uh Italy, and it was kind of crazy because he wouldn't really order anything, he just had a general understanding with his preveyors, like I need this amount of this, and just send me whatever you think is best, and we will just make a new menu every single day, and um it was incredible. I've never seen product like that in my life. Like, imagine if you know you're getting scorpion fish and John Dory's and turbot's from the middle of Bass Country, and it's like I couldn't think of a better place to buy fish from. And uh pigeon like you've never had before. Like it's a totally different. I know, I know, I know, me too. I'm thinking about it right now. I'm just like, man, I could really go for like one of his like pigeon dishes right now, or like a lobster dish. And I had so much fun with the team, they were so good. The uh the pastry chef, like Ricako, like her pastries were so like natural and and uh expressive, like the ingredients that they were using, and um Marcin was like kind of like the CDC at the time that now he just opened his restaurant in Sipselle in uh in Paris, uh, which is getting a ton of like great buzz and and um just very, very talented people that I got to be around um over there that I needed to stay as long as possible, and it kind of solidified the idea of like what I wanted my first restaurant to be.
SPEAKER_01So at this point you're already thinking, like, alright, yeah, I'm ready.
SPEAKER_00I was like, I'm either gonna stay in Paris and I started the process through my Colombian um nationality, or I'm going to go back home and go out on my own and open a restaurant, a Tacy Minute restaurant that's always changing. That's affordable is like a relevant, you know, term. It's what's affordable is different for many people, but like in terms of like what is going on like in the ecosystem of restaurants, I wanted to make something that was something that you know, like a line cook somewhere here can go eat on their day off and have a nice time. Um so I started piecing together like what that would look like. I started looking at spaces when I was still in France. Um I made the decision that I should go back home and do this and settle myself and put some plant some roots down to stay. Um because it was also gonna be the only way I was gonna be like happy, like um staying here. And I knew I wanted to live in Miami, and I knew my fiance definitely wanted to stay in Miami.
SPEAKER_01Um But also you now you had a really good background and understanding, a very well rounded background and understanding. So if it's an outsider, it sounds like it was a great timing.
SPEAKER_00It was great timing.
SPEAKER_01Like Okay, I have all this. Yeah, like I think experience and vision. Let's do it.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I was like, let's I was like, the only thing is to just do it. I was like, time to like put in the work. What is it gonna take? Take, you know, how much do I have to raise? And that was a whole other thing. You know, but um I had made the decision. I was like, I want to come back home and open a restaurant. I want to open the kind of restaurant that like I wanted to work at that was perfect for me, you know? And um and the idea started building from there. I knew it was gonna be a tasty menu, I knew it was going to be less than 30 seats, I knew that it still needed to be enough seats so I could pay the insane rent prices like down here. And um kind of started building a plant from there and I was like, okay, what's it gonna look like? I was like, what is a design, you know a design like quality that I could take that I know is inexpensive to make, but feels intentional. I was like, I can I started thinking about like the juxtaposition of like brutalism in Latin America, because it's like brutalism is very cold and there's edges and it's grey and it's concrete.
SPEAKER_01But then I was like, you go and you see in Latin America and it's like it's painted pink and there's like plants hanging over it, you know, and and it's alive and you can hear people and and uh and the candles bring the melt-up candles brings in the little bit of romance, right? You know, the lighting, the dim lighting.
SPEAKER_00And it it it's it it all came together. I was like, okay, I know it's gonna be like lime wash.
SPEAKER_01I really love the finding the location. Or no, just in general.
SPEAKER_00Oh, no, this is before I was thinking about like the design of the restaurant, but I didn't have money to like hire a designer, and I also uh it's like trust is a big thing for me, and I I didn't know anyone at the time. Now I know some people that I would trust to help out with the design of a space or something, but I didn't know anyone. Um and I knew I wanted that. I knew I wanted uh, you know, laminated birch plywood furniture because it's low in cost, but I really love seeing the layers of it and it's uh it's uh stable. Um I knew that I wanted some kind of like most of the floors and houses in uh Colombia have like uh river rocks like set into the concrete. So it almost looks like a terrazzo, but not really. So I knew I wanted the countertop to have that feeling, so we like I had it made with like river rocks diff different sizes like set into it, but like polished flat so it would feel like a terrazzo. Um the candles I knew it needed to be like an open kitchen, um and yeah, and I found two spaces. One was rented. Uh I showed up literally standing in the rain, calling the agent that I'd set up the meeting with, and he calls me. He's like, Oh, I actually rented that last week. And I was like, You didn't think of telling me. Yeah, and that was the old uh cake tie space.
SPEAKER_01Oh my gosh.
SPEAKER_00On uh Biscayne and the what is it, 79th?
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Um and I thought that's much smaller than all, or it's yeah, but I wanted something that small.
SPEAKER_00I was like, I wanted something that I could work with like two people. Um it was fun, you know, you go to Paris, there's like tons of places that are it's like a it's like this, it's like a little room. Um so I thought, okay, what else is there? And I found the space that I'm in now uh had the shape, almost this like a shotgun shape, that I thought was very like efficient. Um the layout was open, it wasn't set up really to be a restaurant, it was supposed to be like a cafe, I think. So it didn't have enough electrical or plumbing or anything, but it was a blank box. It had a hood that was working, I had a new grease trap, and the walls were already primed white. The floor was unfinished, there was no counter, there was nothing there, there wasn't enough plumbing, all this stuff, but it was the right shape, and I thought it could work. And the location I'd known it because for one, going to Garcia's, and for two, my mom had always gone to the mechanic on the corner of the bridge, like running.
SPEAKER_01That's not a Miami story. And the little supermarket right next to it.
SPEAKER_00And I known this, I had like a little sense of familiarity, and as I step, you know, you step outside and you can see downtown, you can see Brickle. I live maybe in one of the furthest neighborhoods, you know, in like Miami Beach area. Um, but nothing is more than 20 minutes away of like Coram, Miami. And we had a parking lot. It's a city where you drive, you know, you don't there's not much public transit to take to get around, you know, and so you're getting in a car and you're setting out and you gotta put your car somewhere, you know? And I thought, okay, the street parking, super easy in the daytime. The parking lot's here, tons of space. Uh, this could work. There's no other restaurants around here really, but this could work, you know. And uh signed the lease, and then the mission started. I was handling everything. I was handling the permits for the business. I was handling I had my day scheduled in a way where I knew I needed to spend the early morning going to the city and county offices to handle the permitting, and then the midday into afternoon was for working on the space, and then the nighttime was for checking on like financials and anything on my computer, and every day was structured in that way so I could get the most amount done.
SPEAKER_01Um and this is true, it took him two years to answer my email.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00I was I had to put it in there somewhere. I had so much I was doing everything, you know. When I think when you sent me the email, I was also handling the wine for the restaurant and like making time to like taste while also like doing um running the business and then running it as a chef. So it was um you were busy. It was uh just a little bit, right? But it was a lot.
SPEAKER_01And now you're ignoring purveyors on the phone.
SPEAKER_00No, I'll I'll uh I'll call him back. He's doing me a favor. But um it was a lot handling the permitting process, all of that. I remember I would show up, I was like, I'll see you again tomorrow at the same time until we figure this out. And eventually they would either get sick of me, that's a good or just want to help me because they saw I really cared about this.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00And um and it it all worked out.
SPEAKER_01I got how long from finding the space to opening?
SPEAKER_00Three months.
SPEAKER_01That's record time.
SPEAKER_00Three months.
SPEAKER_01Okay.
SPEAKER_00Uh it took us the longest task was lime wash painting it. It was me and my fiancee doing the whole thing. And it's it's kind of a tall space, and it all has to be done by hand, and you have to do at least two layers. So it was it was a lot, but everything was the both of us and and some of my family, my dad, my stepfather, my mom, everyone kind of came together uh to help make it happen. Uh, her father as well, uh, and and and her mother. But everything is like the speakers that are in there, like they're mine that I had at home. I the wiring is I went to Best Buy, I bought speaker wires, and I bought these little plastic uh things to run the wire through along the wall, like it's all put together. I put the amp there in front of the range because I knew I was gonna be having to cook and control the music and also be expoing on the little area of the wall uh at the same time.
SPEAKER_01Explain um Palma for those who have never been there or haven't heard of it, or what would you want them to know?
SPEAKER_00So Palma is uh we do a nine-course tasting menu that changes monthly, um, but with the intention of working with uh product like when it's at its best to allow that flexibility. Um I think usually like people want to ask like what is a cuisine, you know, and and it's so it's it doesn't really fit into one shoe, you know. It's like it reflects a lot of like my own experiences growing up. Like I kind of like ate my way through the world, like we got to travel so much um being a part of like an airline family. Um you know, I've gotten to go to like Asia, all over South America, like much of this country, much of Europe. Um I've been so lucky to see and eat so much that it would be remiss to not mention that. And that's why it's so difficult to kind of like put it in like one box because a lot of the dishes like they're either ideas I have because I know this ingredient is coming in, and I was like, man, I think this combination's gonna be really nice. Um, or it's built on like a memory of like wow, like I really want this like piece of turbot to have like a kiss of flames from like one that I had like in Spain like five years ago or something, or like I want this uh dish with like lobster head in it to like taste and have this like certain creaminess of like something I'm remembering from like another trip, you know, or like I want this to taste like a soup dumpling that I've had in like Beijing like when I was a kid, and I'm always like toying with these like uh memories and like how to kind of make some of these parts of a dish come out.
SPEAKER_01My first experience, I was so excited to visit, and then I remember just open the door. I was I think I was like one of the first ones there because I had an early reservation, yeah, and then the the aroma of the plantain bread.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, that's uh I mean that's what welcomed me.
SPEAKER_01And I guess because it's a small space, but I I remember I threw the door open, it was very excited, and I was like, Oh, and you were like there, you looked up, you're like, Oh, welcome! And I was like, Oh, this is gonna be good. Like, I could smell it now.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it's the only thing that doesn't change.
SPEAKER_01Better not. It's uh I knew it hit me like in the best of ways.
SPEAKER_00It's good. What is what's better?
SPEAKER_01It's like there is besides bread, but it was just it's intoxicating in the best way.
SPEAKER_00It's a nice, you can almost smell that there's Maludo like in it, you know, because there's a little bit of like sweet earthiness uh in the smell, even when you bake the bread. Um, but that was a whole like uh I was like, I want to make a bread that feels like it could only exist here. Like I want to make a bread that's some kind of like nostalgia, yeah. And it's it's like I grew up with Maduro's, like I'm sure you did. I'm sure many people that grew up in Miami, whether they are it doesn't matter where they're from, they ever been American through and through or not, or from you know, Europe or whatever. If you grew up here, you know what they are. And I wanted to make a bread and butter course that was like emblematic of like the city that we're in. So I was like, I really like the idea of like the Mauru with like a soft like brioche. Um, so I kind of like figured out a hybrid recipe of like brioche and like Parker house roll. Um and then in the butter, I wanted to make um my mom makes like the best arroz con coco, which is like you have to reduce coconut milk down until it's just like the fat and the sugars, and it looks like almost like little like rice crispies of like brown coconut goodness. So I was like, I want to take that and then like whip that and uh some of the fat with some really nice like butter, and then I want to like dust it with some uh plantain leaves to add a little bit more like aromatic touch, but use this ingredient, you always remember the smell, you know. If you've had like a tamal or something like wrapped in it, you remember the you open it and you just get the smell of like the leaf. So I was like, let's try like drying it and turning it into like a spice and dusting the butter with that, and then it's like the whole like uh it's perfect experience, yeah. Uh and haven't changed it since. I I really love it.
SPEAKER_01Good. How long from when you opened to the Michelin ceremony last year? Um It had it hadn't been a whole year, right?
SPEAKER_00It was uh maybe not. Maybe not. I don't know. My my uh sense of like time of like the beginning of the restaurant to now is like so crazy.
SPEAKER_01Well it was April 25.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And you opened when in 24 We opened it? Well, you just had an anniversary, so we opened January. So a little bit over a year.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, we opened like I think the the second week of January.
SPEAKER_0124.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, 24. Okay. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01So it wasn't that ceremony, it was last year's ceremony, 25.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
unknownOkay.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, that was uh So you get an email or an invite or yeah, I got an email.
SPEAKER_00Uh well, actually, first it was like the request for like the survey.
SPEAKER_01Oh right. And then I was like the surveys where they ask um your information and yeah, confirm this information.
SPEAKER_00All that stuff. Yeah. I, you know, all of this, and I was like, oh shit. They've been to the restaurant, they wrote about this. I know they had this menu because we change it every month.
SPEAKER_01So and you put numbers on your menu. Yeah. I love.
SPEAKER_00And um, and I was like, oh wow. Uh I guess I'll fill this out and add some photos and see what happens.
SPEAKER_01How early did they go based on the what they said?
SPEAKER_00It was um September.
SPEAKER_01Okay, so later in the year.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, like eight, nine months in.
SPEAKER_01Okay, that's good.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_01Better than right in the m beginning.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. And uh definitely better than right in the beginning.
SPEAKER_01Um Although I went menu number one.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And ten.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And then I think like after that, but then you started doing a not weekly, you started changing right because Yeah, we switched from weekly to monthly because it was it was uh Yeah, that was very ambitious at first.
SPEAKER_00It was madness. I think it's it's definitely possible just like with more staff.
SPEAKER_01But my one and ten for sure were weeks, and then you went into monthly.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Um it was the best change like we could have done.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. And then okay, so the you get the survey?
SPEAKER_00You get the survey, look at it, approve it. I was like, fuck, when's the ceremony? I was like, what when does the ceremony even happen for like Miami, you know? And I was like, okay, it looks like it's gonna be like the first week of April. So I'm just like anxious, like until then. I'm like, what is it? And then I get another like survey as well. So then I'm like, I don't think we're just getting added to the guide, like something else is gonna be given. Yeah, like just that. Like, we also got a request for like uh an interview uh from like Michelin for a news article, so it's like they don't just do that for like everyone. The recommended right now. Um so then that made me more anxious. And um obviously like going into it, like you're hopeful, and and you know, we drove out there and it was like it was a really wonderful surprise, and I think it was really um it was really cool because it was like uh I think that award's really cool.
SPEAKER_01Very cool.
SPEAKER_00The young chef award.
SPEAKER_01I think it's uh I think it was a perfect award.
SPEAKER_00I f I feel that way too as well. Um I think um it's almost like a we believe in you. Like we see what you're doing, keep going. Um and it was really cool. I was totally, I was like, I looked, I looked at Daniela, my fiancee was like, what's that? That's my name. And she's like, go. And uh and yeah.
SPEAKER_01By the way, it was the young chef recognition award.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, the mission young chef award for for Florida.
SPEAKER_01So what are your goals now? How's it going? What are you planning for now?
SPEAKER_00Uh you know, my goals are just we're going through some really wonderful, like growing pains right now. The restaurant is busy.
SPEAKER_01Um You're up to menu 29? Is that the one I had the other day?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, 29 right now. I'm in the middle of uh writing menu 30. Um Sean and Alyssa have been like a wonderful addition to the team. Alyssa's like our front of house manager now, and and Sean's handling the beverage program.
SPEAKER_01Like Is that who I met the other day? I I think I had already met him before that. Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I think you have met him before. And it's just um them like understanding what I want to do so well. Just a kind of like honest, genuine like hospitality, no frills, like for anything. Like uh it's it's all very like very there and like in front of you. Like there's no uh smoke show or like tricks. Um just like building that, building this team and like continuing to to grow with them and um like better guide everyone and just keep pushing, like getting a little bit better, like every month. That's it. It's like a little bit better every month. And then we all we all feel good, like a little bit better over here, a little bit better for like the guest experience, a little bit better for like our beverage list and our offerings, a little bit better for This Last Menu was my favorite one so far. Thank you. I I I hope it continues to feel that way um for our guests, like as we evolve.
SPEAKER_01The the last the last course the pork.
SPEAKER_00Oh yeah. I really like that's from uh that's from like a memory, you know, from like a trip that we took to Portugal. It was like having the some of the best pork that I've had in my life was on that trip. Um but it was it's just sad just to keep getting a little bit better in every single part, even from the moment where like you as a guest like make a reservation, and then when we like contact you like the day before, like giving that opportunity to see if there's anything like special going on, if there's anything that they say, you know, like I'm so excited to like also come like drink wine or something. Then we know like okay, let's go like come with a few things, you know, to the table, um to see uh what they're into and like how we can better personalize each uh reservation. But yeah, that's my biggest biggest goal and ambition right now for the restaurant.
SPEAKER_01Why the name Palma? I forgot to ask you.
SPEAKER_00Uh so it's it's kind of the idea of like us. It's a bridge between like the restaurant to the guests, right? It's like we're offering them like what we do with our hands, with our palms. Um it's how we like connect with them.
SPEAKER_01Oh.
SPEAKER_00That's where our logo is like a hand.
SPEAKER_01I always thought Palma like palm tree, like Florida, palm tree like Palma. It's deeper than the But I've always right, but I've always wondered about the hands and other little Brian. Okay. Okay, got it. Like, why does he keep having the the hand? The the it's all different versions of the hands, like doing different things.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_01Got it, got it. It is. Okay.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it was like uh relaxed hands. We actually looked at a lot of um we recently when we went to go get the plates in uh Colombia for the restaurant, we went to uh Museo de Oro in uh Bogotá and I was so inspired by all of the um literally ancient art that was made with gold and just the way that they would form like hands are very hard to do in art and the way that they would like sculpt hands in certain ways, either like in stone or like with gold or maybe like imprinting like onto gold or something. Like I was very inspired by that and the logo kind of like developed from that.
SPEAKER_01Because come to think of it, there's not a whole lot of palm tree leaves on your anywhere in this restaurant. So I was like, why did he name it palm? I don't care. Okay, it only took a few years to figure that out. Got it. Okay.
SPEAKER_00But yeah, that's how the the name came to be. I don't ever want to move to Palma. Like I think I would love to see that be there and become uh that little spot is now becoming surrounded by by a whole lot of other restaurants and scenes, night scenes.
SPEAKER_01So it's ended up being a good decision.
SPEAKER_00I think uh that whole corridor is like bound to be uh developed, you know, whether that ends up being like good or bad for us is another thing. Uh I guess that'll depend on who ends up being our landlord.
SPEAKER_01Right.
SPEAKER_00Uh if that changes. But um I'd love to see the restaurant become somewhere where you can kind of see other other like talent from the city like come in and like run it as like uh you know like chef de cuisine and kind of like show what they can do and then like be this place in the city where people come in, run it, show who they are and what they can do, and then like go off and start their own restaurant. You know, like that's my ultimate like dream.
SPEAKER_01Right like others did for you.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Has Miles come into the restaurant?
SPEAKER_00No, he's been so busy opening his. It's it's uh I I'm trying to. I'd like to get him out for a dinner. Um Resi. You can give the nudge. Um but yeah, it's on my list to get done. I I'd really love to have Miles in there because I I I want him to see it, but I also want to express to him like in person like how important he was uh for my career. But um that's my like more long-term uh goal or like dream for the restaurant is to kind of like hope that it turns into a place to like keep fostering uh talent like in the city. And uh hopefully some other things like along the way.
SPEAKER_01Good. Thank you so much for joining me today. Is there anything I didn't touch upon that you want Miami diners to know?
SPEAKER_00Uh just if you haven't come to see us, yes, come see us, come visit us. And uh I think it's nice because you can come back every month and have a different experience.
SPEAKER_01Except the bread.
SPEAKER_00That's always gonna be except for the bread.
SPEAKER_01Well, I'm glad we made this happen.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Um, very much like he said, um, Palma isn't loud, it's not trying to be everything, it's controlled, intentional, and that restraint might be its greatest strength. Plus, there's the plantain bread, as I said. And if today's conversation resonated with you, and what we just said, here's what we want you to do: go experience it for yourself, make a reservation, taste the progression, pay attention to the pacing, notice the ingredients, see how Miami is evolving in real time through chefs. Like one. Thank you. And if you enjoyed this episode, share it with someone who still thinks Miami isn't a serious food city. That narrative is so outdated. And subscribe, leave a review, and stay with me because I am continuing to document the chefs shaping this moment. And also before you go, something new is coming on my end. For those of you who want the deeper cuts, the behind the scenes, the unfiltered industry analysis, the fun and at times scandalous bits, and the conversations that don't always make the main feed supplements is on the way. Subscriber content you will not want to miss more soon. Ciao until next time.
